mspaintadventuresfandomcom-20200224-history
Forum:Rename guardian articles
The current names of the guardian articles are really more of a legacy from the pre-Act 6 era of Homestuck, and really for the Strider-Lalondes the guardian article titles don't even really portray them as much more than their relationship to their respective kid. Likewise we have far more sources regarding guardian names now days, so the current article names really go against our own MoS. I think the old guardian titles should be preserved as redirects, and their more common names included at the beginning of their articles. For example: "Jane Egbert, more commonly known as Nanna, ...". This might cause some trouble when discussing the characters in articles, so discussing how their names should be used in articles should be worked out before committing to any change. There would also be some disambiguation issues, but they are fairly easily resolved. And so here is the full list of proposed renames as well as some citations: * Nanna to Jane Egbert – Confirmed as , the surname is mostly presumed. * Grandpa to Jake Harley – Directly called Jake in Hiveswap. * Poppop to John Crocker – He is identified as still being called John . Surname is not in dispute. * Grandma to Jade English – Jake confirms her name fairly early on when discussing the transmaterializer conversations with B1 Jade. * Dave's Bro to Dirk Strider (pre-scratch) – B2 Dirk retains undisambiguated page. Called Dirk in book commentary I believe. * Rose's Mom to Roxy Lalonde (pre-scratch) – B2 Roxy retains undisambiguated page. Called Roxy in book commentary I believe. * Dirk's Bro to Dave Strider (post-scratch) – B1 Dave retains undisambiguated page. * Roxy's Mom to Rose Lalonde (post-scratch) – B1 Rose retains undisambiguated page. - The Light6 (talk) 12:01, October 8, 2016q (UTC) :I vote yes to this change. Per Ankh ED 15:59, October 8, 2016 (UTC) :I'm also in support of this. Some of the surnames may be presumed, but our presumptions really only make sense, and sources are sure to crop up with Hiveswap for some of them. 21:47, October 8, 2016 (UTC) :Additional note, one issue I felt there might be with this proposal is the community at large being opposed to using these name or using them possibly negatively impacting people's ability to use the wiki. However the community at large tends to alternate back and forth between using their title and proper name or some combination. So I doubt there would be significant opposition nor would it hinder the wiki's functionality. - The Light6 (talk) 11:19, October 13, 2016 (UTC) :This discussion kinda petered out, but given Hiveswap is here I think we should get a move on with this. I think we can say without a doubt that Grandpa's name is Jake Harley. Really I think that this is true for the entire guardian set, but if we want to start off with one guardian and proceed from there, I think it should be him. - The Light6 (talk) 04:37, September 24, 2017 (UTC) :Oppose. To me it feels like it makes more sense to identify characters by their "common name", ie the name by which they are most commonly referred to for purposes of easiest identification. Also, the naming scheme for the Guardians seems to have been specifically selected by Hussie, and is adhered to throughout Homestuck. Most of the Guardians are never identified by name, and Hiveswap doesn't change the fact that this was the precedent in most of the canon. I suggest there is a proper formal vote on this change if it is to be made at all. -BlackholeWI (talk) 05:24, September 24, 2017 (UTC) :I'm for it, if only because referring to him as Grandpa in the context of Hiveswap can become slightly confusing. If we don't ultimately go with naming him Jake Harley, I'd at least request a redirect or disambiguation page for "Pa" o "Pa Harley". PatManDX (talk) 05:47, September 24, 2017 (UTC) :I would be opposed to this, because I think there is a difference between their names as people and their names as characters. That might sound strange, but a lot of Homestuck works on multiple layers: implied reality, and the abstracted game/comic/adventure. Different classes of characters in the story have different naming conventions, some of which are real names and some of which are titles. Even though Rose's mom, as a person, was almost certainly named Roxy, in Homestuck her name is Mom because she's a guardian. Only when she is a kid, and thus a "playable" character, does she get a name. It's the same with the ancestors; they all have to have had "real names" too, and we probably know exactly what they are, but they are only ever referred to as titles in the comic because that's how their name pattern works. This is a deliberate pattern, so we should acknowledge it by not naming their pages off of the implied real names when the comic insistently refers to them as titles, even after their "real" names are clear. We definitely should mention confirmed names like Jake in the AKA or trivia sections though. -A (talk) 21:10, September 24, 2017 (UTC)